peppy wrote: 73101g

By definition innovation cannot be useless, but I'm sorry you feel this way. Hopefully next update will have a more useful innovation for you. I think this one will be useful to the majority of the community, though.

I don't think your innovation should remove old functionality, though. I liked being able to look through local scores separately and also seeing out to rank 400~ or so to check for certain mods on some maps. Also, it shouldn't default to unified ranking after each play - it should save your preferred settings.

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase. If you are going to use your entire playerbase as testers, then at least allow options to fallback to old functionality that doesn't include all of the bugs, etc. While this update doesn't affect gameplay directly so it's not so bad, I think the way you are going about pushing these updates out is wrong. I understand you have your vision of how the game is supposed to be, but you have a large base and many very dedicated followers, please take their feelings into consideration as much or moreso than your own.

In any case, it's a good idea, but the current implementation is a mess imo. Needs more organization. I think separate tabs for local, country, friend, overall, mod scores, etc would work better than showing everything in one list -- the current method causes too much clutter/unwanted information. There is never a danger in allowing more specific searching! Possibly instead of tabs, you have checkboxes that you can mix and match for each option. So you can check friend/country and it will show those scores, or just friends and it will show only those. Also make it so that whatever you picked is saved between plays instead of reset (this should happen currently, as well)

mochi wrote: 3b6z1c

peppy wrote: 73101g

I am considering everyone's opinions here.

I just want to view the rankings of my friends. I don't want to search for my friends that are scattered amongst a bunch of other scores i don't care about.

If you're gonna keep the unified list, don't even bother putting in our local scores in it too. Because sometimes i clear a single map like 20 times ok? I don't need to see my name 20 times in a already cluttered list.

^This

It would seem prudent to separate Local scores from Online scores. There's absolutely no reason to show every local score you ever had on a map you've played. Especially if you've played said map hundreds of times.

I don't have er so I haven't looked at the friend ranking scoreboard, however what mochi said seems about right for that too.

Edit: I like the point differential shown below accuracy. I think the new scoreboard is a good idea, just improperly implemented.

Peppy, in general, I love the new update, I like the friends score (although it does make me feel bad sometimes) and the way scores work when you play now. Also, thanks so much for fixing the complaints with the skin update so quickly, that was really great!

I have to agree though, that everything is a bit crowded... I understand the desire to save space, but I was so confused by the update I had to read almost the entire thread to figure it out entirely.

I would agree with a tabs solution, despite you seeming against it.

Couple of quick things:

1. You say that we can toggle a lot of the new changes... could you please point out where? Maybe I'm being dense, but I can't find them...

2. You also mentioned a pp change? Are you going to elaborate soon?

[Added] 3. I think its a bit weird that when I'm playing with no mods, I see all of the no-mods scores below my highest, modded score. E.G I have a score with HD and DT, and see a bunch of lower scores without mods underneath it when I'm playing no mods. I know you want to encourage more competiton among no mods groups, but that information means nothing to me below my score... Perhaps this feature could only engage when we start to play a map. Or perhaps the "same mods" should be according to the mods on our highest score? Not trying to be critical in the slightest, just suggesting some alternatives

Thanks for (if you actually do) reading!

Ps. Peppy, I think that you are bringing a lot of cool changes in Osu!, but bringing them far to quickly. It seems as if you face a torrent of differing opinions when you release these HUGE updates. I think it would be beneficial to you and the community if you slowed the updates down a bit, so you could better receive our opinion and gauge the effectiveness of what you release.

Would have been nice to use Community Voice to gauge the reception of such a change.

"Would you like unified rankings?" with "Yes", "No", "Neutral" as possible answers, with some explanations and a mock-up in the OP.

Good Job! That'll help out a bit. You play the piano? (I'm only asking because of that video on your channel)

peppy wrote: 73101g

As long as it is being limited to ~50 items, I am not splitting it out into multiple options, sorry. Looking to keep things simple when it comes to the interface, because i'd like to increase vertical space in the near future. Scrolling ain't that hard .

If anything, the unified ranking increases complexity in my opinion. It doesn't make a lot of sense to have four different sets of scores mashed together. You're usually only interested in one of the sets at a time. Since the sets overlap on the scoreboard, you'll have to gather the information you're looking for yourselves.

About same mod scores: I'm not really interested in them. Competing with players who (for the most part) I've never heard of seems kinda pointless to me. It doesn't really tell me how good my score was unless I look up all the players who got similar scores. I don't want to do that. Comparing yourselves to the top 50, your friends or your country tells you way more about the quality of your score. It's more fun too since you have some sort of relation to these players, they're not just names. Most people play nomod anyway, and having tons of SS on the scoreboard is useless.

The scoreboard is an important part of the game. I think giving up usability for a bit of vertical space is a bad idea. I don't think the current implementation is simple at all. A scoreboard switcher doesn't have to be fancy either. A single button for switching through the scoreboards would be sufficient.

mochi wrote: 3b6z1c

peppy wrote: 73101g

I am considering everyone's opinions here.

I just want to view the rankings of my friends. I don't want to search for my friends that are scattered amongst a bunch of other scores i don't care about.

If you're gonna keep the unified list, don't even bother putting in our local scores in it too. Because sometimes i clear a single map like 20 times ok? I don't need to see my name 20 times in a already cluttered list.

Following from this, here's an idea:

How about customizable scoreboard settings, instead of one design forced upon everyone?

If someone only wants to see their local scores, they shoud be able to only see local scores. If they want to see locals+friends, or friends+local top (only their top) score, or local+friends+online, they should be able to control exactly which of these are visible (and even maybe which colors are used for highlighting, etc.)

It seems that the best way to solve the problem would be just to separate the local/online scores.
It gets to a point where the leaderboards start to look ridiculous...

Silynn wrote: 376o1

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.

You're obviously new here. This is how I've developed osu! for the last 6 years and I don't intend on changing that. The fact that bugs are fixed within hours if not days should be enough to counter any negatives brought on by this rapid release cycle.

If you would like to help with testing, you can the few people on the test server that tend to help me test. Anyone is welcome to help.

peppy wrote: 73101g

Silynn wrote: 376o1

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.

You're obviously new here. This is how I've developed osu! for the last 6 years and I don't intend on changing that. The fact that bugs are fixed within hours if not days should be enough to counter any negatives brought on by this rapid release cycle.

If you would like to help with testing, you can the few people on the test server that tend to help me test. Anyone is welcome to help.

>new here

Also the minimal testing refers mostly to the playability of the new features and how much they change the game.

If you feel this way then how about helping test? The features were live weeks before public release, and heavily tested by only 3-4 s.

Silynn wrote: 376o1

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.

Don't you think that there is a possibility that a hand full of people cannot find every single Bug and that the Community which doesn't use the Test Build would be a good way to find them?

Stefan wrote: 72304b

Silynn wrote: 376o1

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.

Don't you think that there is a possibility that a hand full of people cannot find every single Bug and that the Community which doesn't use the Test Build would be a good way to find them?

Pretty much this. The general community may moan and complain, but bugs get fixed and features get tweaked so much faster when everyone is pitching in (intentionally or not)
This is the fastest way to progress osu! forward, and big, exciting things would be delayed so much longer otherwise, not to mention critical bug fixes. Unhappiness from the vocal minority is a small price to pay.

I disagree on a fundamental level, you shouldn't push out updates to the detriment of your players. At the very least, like I said, include fallbacks to older versions on major updates (skin changes, leaderboard changes, etc) until everything in the system is smoothed out. This way, the players who want to see these features will end up helping out, and the people who can't be fucked to help but are bothered by the bugs, changes, etc, have something to go back to in the mean time.

Silynn wrote: 376o1

This way, the players who want to see these features will end up helping out, and the people who can't be fucked to help but are bothered by the bugs, changes, etc, have something to go back to in the mean time.

This is already possible, The fallback is the difference between osu! and osu!test

And that's where I disagree, just because a player has a er tag does not mean they want to be a tester. Be considerate of your base, please.

I never said they had to, it's up to them whether they want to test or not.

And then they're being forced to test once features that aren't ready to be pushed to live are pushed to live.

All I ask for is to not force this upon people and add a way to fall back.

I'm not changing the way I push updates, sorry. The reason I can work so hard on osu! is due to how fast I can push stuff out. If this was to change I would probably lose a lot of motivation.

I think that's immature, and that you should be more considerate of the thousands of s you have (this isn't a small community anymore!), but do what you like. I can't stop you, but I'm still going to voice my opinion, and hope you'll at least put some thought into it.

(I guess it's 2 million total s? Although a while ago you said only 300,000~ or so were active, still, that is quite a large base)

Is impossible to please everyone .

Also I'm not sure you should speak on behalf of the community as a whole. Other people may not share your opinions about the way I develop being "inconsiderate".

I'll speak on behalf of myself, and the many people that I know for a fact agree. Would you like me to gather them to post in this thread?

And I don't quite understand why you are so against letting people use older versions of the software or older features in place of newer ones that they dislike. What's wrong with letting people customize the game interface as they see fit?

Also, to me, personally, the unified ranking is almost 100% useless. Why is it being forced upon me every time I restart a map? You can at least add in a setting that saves whether or not you have the unified ranking box checked. This is an actual suggestion for the update, and one I strongly feel should be implemented.

Please read up. I've already addressed the unified ranking issues.

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.
You're obviously new here. This is how I've developed osu! for the last 6 years and I don't intend on changing that. The fact that bugs are fixed within hours if not days should be enough to counter any negatives brought on by this rapid release cycle.

If you would like to help with testing, you can the few people on the test server that tend to help me test. Anyone is welcome to help.

Is that what the Osu Test Program was for? I haven't figured out where it is but I'd like to help out!

EDIT:Added quotes, I was unaware that there were more posts to read. And sorry if I'm interrupting something.

Willi096 wrote: 323566

Also, you're doing the same thing you did with the last update - forcing a large change (full of bugs) with very minimal testing on the entire playerbase.
You're obviously new here. This is how I've developed osu! for the last 6 years and I don't intend on changing that. The fact that bugs are fixed within hours if not days should be enough to counter any negatives brought on by this rapid release cycle.

If you would like to help with testing, you can the few people on the test server that tend to help me test. Anyone is welcome to help.

Is that what the Osu Test Program was for? I haven't figured out where it is but I'd like to help out!

EDIT:Added quotes, I was unaware that there were more posts to read.

When you run osume.exe, you can click the osu!test check box in the extra's tab, and it will the osu!test.exe into your osu root folder. Of course this only works for ers.

Oh, I was looking in Osu, not the folder. Thanks for the help~ How do I know what I'm testing and what I'm looking for though?

Willi096 wrote: 323566

Oh, I was looking in Osu, not the folder. Thanks for the help~ How do I know what I'm testing and what I'm looking for though?

http://ha.ppy.sh/

Edit: Also feel free to ask in the test server's chat

Sankyuu Sakura~

peppy wrote: 73101g

Please read up. I've already addressed the unified ranking issues.

Link me to the post? I read through the whole thread and I'm not seeing it. Of course if I missed it, then that's my bad and I apologize.

Can we please have the Top 400 back? Also, it would be better if you make a scoreboard that has all the players that have played the map

What happened ? Yesterday it was working fine : I could see all my friends score, local score, the top6 and a bunch of score made with the mods I had selected. Today on the same maps I only get a bunch of scores with the same mod and local scores. No top 6, no friends score.
I liked it a lot like it was yesterday, except that there were too many score in the "same mods"category.

Piotrekol wrote: 5v4al

So we can't see top 400 anymore?
not that i need it~ :3

Why not? then people can't see your score

I've changed this behaviour slightly in the release today.

Thanks, this looks much better! Less clutter overall and easier to find the information you're looking for.

I love this update

Please add "Country" filter too! Pleaseeeeeee ;_;

Thanks peppy, this is about perfect now.

game crashes if you press F2 while filtering local scores

I like this much better than the last attempt, thx peppy.

119410501 wrote: o134

Please add "Country" filter too! Pleaseeeeeee ;_;

Wow actually, I really like this idea. I don't know about other countries' player base, but at least in Canada I know we like to compare against each other quite a lot. This would be really fantastic to see as an option in game.

the actual one is nice ! add even more filters if you can

I seriously don't understand what the "rank" in the friends scoreboard is xD They just look like random numbers.
Also, your own score should be added to the friends scoreboard. I'd like to actually compare my score to my friends; not just looking at them

CXu wrote: 344051

I seriously don't understand what the "rank" in the friends scoreboard is xD They just look like random numbers.
Also, your own score should be added to the friends scoreboard. I'd like to actually compare my score to my friends; not just looking at them

Your online record is still shown below, so you actually can compare it. o.o

Zarerion wrote: 6z4f1h

Your online record is still shown below, so you actually can compare it. o.o

Having your score at the correct place would be more intuitive though because you could instantly see who had better or worse scores than you.

Wow i love this seperation

YodaSnipe wrote: 2x2q5d

119410501 wrote: o134

Please add "Country" filter too! Pleaseeeeeee ;_;

Wow actually, I really like this idea. I don't know about other countries' player base, but at least in Canada I know we like to compare against each other quite a lot. This would be really fantastic to see as an option in game.

Yeah, that's it, that would be really useful, also because for the majority, the friends you care more are not ALL the ones in your friendlist but especially the ones from your same country, it's less spammy than a Friendlist

So...I updated my osu! today and now my osu! immediately becomes not responding whenever I press random or F2 button in beatmap selection. Anyone else having the same problem?

really good job peppy. Keep it up ^^
I also agree with local rankings section. It would be cool. hope to see that in the future :3

Thank you peppy!

One thing though: You should make it so you can see yourself on friend's leaderboards for easy comparison. You don't want the 2nd best friend to be "#1 out of your friends", you want to be #1 out of everyone. (friends and including yourself). If that makes sense.

The ranking split now is a huge improvement, thanks a lot!
I absolutely love the friends filter

/E: It still sometimes scrolls to my score but sometimes doesn't. Not sure if intentional and I just can't see the pattern when it happens. I'd really prefer if it didn't scroll but this is small enough that I could get used to it.

Love the way the ranking is now, good job!! ovo

Well done peps.

There we go. This format can stay in my opinion. Easy to understand, easy to use. Thanks again !

I would be fine with this, but every time I change song/play/do pretty much anything, it reticks the Unified thing. Requesting it to keep itself unticked, if unticked once.

Static Noise Bird wrote: p5k4c

I would be fine with this, but every time I change song/play/do pretty much anything, it reticks the Unified thing. Requesting it to keep itself unticked, if unticked once.

It's already changed again.

Much better now, thanks

This isn't really a bug, but the mention "Local: XX" when displaying local ranking is now redundant with "Top: XX" and should be removed.

I think it would be clearer if the "Same mod" option was named "Current mod" instead. "Same mod" seems to mean "same mod as your online score".

Also it would be nice to see yourself listed in the friends section, to quickly see how good you did compared to your friends (which is the main point of this filter).

Damnae wrote: hz1r

I think it would be clearer if the "Same mod" option was named "Current mod" instead. "Same mod" seems to mean "same mod as your online score".

Also it would be nice to see yourself listed in the friends section, to quickly see how good you did compared to your friends (which is the main point of this filter).

Or rather change it to "Selected mod", I think that'd be much clearer.

Look at the situation

Much better

good stuff

good job

"You need to be a er to use this feature, sorry!" <- LOL, I really wanted to see the top of friends, hehehe, when can ($$ ), I get er.

Also, I agree the idea of top country, I think that would help a lot to noobs become more competitive among them (especially in countries like mine, where there are not so many players).

sadfasig
I still dont understand the new ranks

* delete *

Well this is pretty awesome! :3

Wish my old mouse would stop being broken...that or wish my new mouse would be more able for osu!

Would so use the hell out of this Update... <3 Osu!!!!!

peppy wrote: 73101g

Show local scores is gone forever unless you play offline ().

Why? I like to occasionally compare an old replay to a more recent play. Logging out will be a pain. Why would you do this? Is there any benefit to anyone?

I liked viewing top 400 because I'm more likely to float in those ranks than top 100 and I like to see how badly I'm doing compared to others.

Local scores are back... this is an old announcement, silly

Please don't post here anymore.

Latest public release announcement is here.

I love these updates/Releases